| Image courtesy of We're Trying Records |
The following interview was ACTUALLY conducted over email in September of 2025. It has only been lightly edited and reformatted from its original contents.
Is there an overall theme to your LP No Alternative?
When we wrote this album, an election was starting, colleges across the country were protesting, rhetoric about dictatorship was ramping up, and we were seeing AI proliferate across social media and into every aspect of life. All of this had us asking ourselves how we got to this point and why things had to be this way, could there possibly be any hope of things getting better? To sort of make sense of all of it there were a few books we read, one of them being particularly relevant was Capitalist Realism: Is There No Alternative? by Mark Fisher. It really reinforced our sort of pessimistic idea of; there is no alternative to modern life, that choice has been taken away from us all. This is all happening by design. None of this was by accident.
The cover for No Alternative is gorgeous! Where was that photo taken? What is in these murals?
I know you're big Blink-182 fans, and I can still hear some of their influences here, but it also feels like you're leaning more into the grungier aspects of your sound with this record. Why did that feel like the right move for this material?
We’re influenced by so many bands and sounds. I do think it’s purely coincidence that some of these songs land on a grunge style, but I think that’s because there’s a lot of angst and anger behind the lyrics and it simply comes out in the music. There’s a lot for us to be angry about right now.
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| Image courtesy of We're Trying Records |
Do you think there are any inherent overlaps between emo and grunge music? Where are the gelling points for these two styles in your mind?
They’re both styles of music that are very emotion-forward, I think Sunny Day Real Estate is the best example of that crossover. There’s a lot of frustration in both genres, just different time periods. In the 90s there was a lot of frustration around boredom, meaninglessness and leading a bland life. I think in the 2020s the frustration is watching a society with no one at the wheel, doomed to watch a dystopian nightmare day after day while the populous numbs itself. I also think bands like Nirvana sort of poked fun at the same aspects of modern society we poke fun at; the white picket fences and suburban lifestyles that seem cognitively dissonant to reality, where a world running out of resources wants to sell you bigger homes and bigger trucks.
What is the deal with the Bear v Shark callout on the opening track? Are you trying to start some beef with them, or do you genuinely think bears and sharks can cohabitate?
It’s actually a reference to a Space Ghost Coast to Coast episode, and thought it was a fun nod to a lot of the song titles we had on the last album. But also Bears and Sharks being scummy finance people.
It's excellent to hear how you are expanding your sound with tracks like "Victory Speech" and "Palo Alto." It sounds like you've been listening to a lot of Failure or even Deftones while writing this record, with how bleak and claustrophobically spacey they are. Can you give some insights into how/why you attempted to cultivate a consistent sense of crushing atmosphere on this album?
We’ve always listened to bands and albums that have a very desolate, crushing feeling to it, but until this album we’ve never really had the confidence to take that on. We really approached this album with the thought of “What if this was the last thing we ever got to record?” and decided to shoot for the moon. We just really wanted to make a complete artistic statement.
How do you feel as though your sound has evolved between your debut and No Alternative, and what direction do you hope to take it in the future?
We wanted to make a darker record that spoke to people who felt like everything around us is going wrong and wanted something that sonically was a bit of a deeper listen. I only see us going further on the next one. This is a dense record, we packed a lot into this 32 minutes, I think we try to make the next more cinematic, more ambitious, more experimental. We’re probably going to take this sounds and go further with it, this one feels more like a “Scarlet Street” record than anything else we’ve ever done and we want to chase that feeling.
What do you hope is the big takeaway from this album for listeners (besides, "Wow, that ruled!")?
I want people to see this as a reflection of the social and political climate we’re in now. I want to make the people who feel like everything is falling apart feel seen. There’s a lot of people out there who don’t feel like there’s music that speaks to the moment that’s happening right now, and we wanted this music to do just that. We simply made an album we want to listen to, if people are on our wavelength, all the better.
We wanted to show immediately to everyone that we weren’t fucking around with this album.
From the get go this was going to be the album opener because it set the tone with all the angst
and frustration we are feeling with the systems of the world. We feel trapped, and sometimes it
feels like the only way out is to simply die by the 2 things the powers that be love the most;
Guns or Drugs.
"VICTORY SPEECH"
This is the other side of the situation; it’s the ticker tape parade of those in power gloating about
how well the deck is stacked. Once again, we just came right out with showing off the heavier
sound we’d been working on. The chorus comes from this part in the book The Chaos Machine
by Max Fisher, where the overwhelming majority of start ups in Silicon Valley are pumped full of
money by venture capitalists in the hopes that one of them will be the next Facebook or Oracle
or Plantir. If they don’t pan out it doesn’t matter, what’s a couple billion dollars? This is one of our
favorite songs to play live simply because of how much ground it covers between the spacey
verses, screaming choruses and the final breakdown.
"WARNING SOUNDS"
Every day the world feels like it’s going to collapse, and every day you’re still suppose to clock in
and go to work. I’ve always had a tough time staying focused when particularly gloomy world
events are happening, and yet it seems like co-workers have no problem just shrugging off
impending fascism. For me, I’ll simply never be able to turn those sirens in the back of my head
off, I guess I’m glad others can. That’s what this song is about. We really took a liking to Prawn
and Signals Midwest on this. Just wanted to show off gloominess without heft for once.
"DRINKS ON THE HOUSE / PALO ALTO"
We really just wanted to write something brainlessly heavy and when we threw on the fuzz pedal
and played this, it just sounded right. It’s a song about being completely brain dead while
scrolling all day long. I’m very cautious about social media use, I think it’s a really good tool to
numb the populous into just being content instead of getting up off their ass and doing
something, hopefully that doesn’t sound too self-righteous, but I think we all need to take a
minute and ask ourselves if this shit is actually improving our lives in a meaningful way or if it’s
just something we’re all collectively addicted to. Anyway, the post-chorus “You’re sick inside your
brain/And we can take away the pain” is my little version of a quote from Capitalist Realism;
“You’re sick because of you’re brain chemistry. We can fix you with our SSRI’s” - Essentially
casting off the fact that everyone is constantly mentally ill as being a fault of the individual
instead of the root cause being; this world is literally mentally torture. Fun fact; I wrote this song
while trying to learn "Snag" by Cheem.*
"HAIL"
I went down a lot of rabbit holes and read a lot of non-fiction while writing this album, and one of
the most influential was probably The Storm Is Here: An American Crucible by Luke Mogelson, it
recounts the lead up to January 6th and protests during the pandemic. I feel like we’ve all
collectively moved on from January 6th without learning a single lesson. But anyway, I think
there was something so dark and twisted about the people who just mindlessly decided to join
this death cult on the far-right, like they felt compelled to take matters into their own hands at the
cost of everything. That scares me. That keeps me up at night, and I really think it should keep
everyone else up, too. That’s what this song is about; those who are willing to kill their fellow
humans over things made up by bots in memes and videos on the internet. All Hail The Line, All
Hail The Hook. This song was originally split off from the 1st incantation of “CORPORATE
MEMPHIS” actually, but our producer thought it was a little weird, so the verse from that became
the bulk of this song, and the chorus from "CORPORATE MEMPHIS" became the verses.
This whole track spawned from a real-life occurrence of hellish, Black Mirror-esque serendipity
that I’m sure people think I made up, but I use to have this Samsung phone that had Bixby
and when the alarm went off, instead of a chime or bell, it played the Bixby assistant reciting the
headlines of the day. This was mid-2020 and of course every headline was the worst news you
had ever heard. It stuck with me for years, and I wanted to make something that reminded me of
that. We set out to make a sort of funeral march of headlines, and we wanted it to build up and
sound like what it feels to just take in every bit of horror that the human condition has to endure.
This song had somewhere north of 50 tracks, easily the most dense recording we’ve ever made.
We tried to make it as symbolic as possible, as well. Almost every headline is real, except for 3
or 4 because we wanted to symbolize the fact that with as much misinformation as there is you
can literally never tell what’s real and what’s fake. Even the ending “No rain in the forecast”
symbolizes that there’s no relief coming. We titled the song after one of our favorite Instagram
profiles, (now goes by doomscroll_forever) - it felt apt.
I was inspired by the poem “First They Came...” - I really despise the state of activism in
America right now, where it seems like posting on social media is the beginning and end of the
lengths in which people are willing to go to stop literal fascism and genocide from occurring, it’s
all so performative. This song is a critique on people who do that. While people post that they
stand against something and do nothing else, others are being rounded up in the country and
other countries and killed. The music on this track is one of the oldest on the whole album, it
actually predates our first album, and we almost used it on the first one, but it felt too heavy and
slow to make sense. I really think it found its place perfectly there.
This came out of complete frustration with the music industry. It really feels like there are a
million hurdles in the way of doing anything successfully in music, and there are a million-and-
one people who are willing to take your money from you. It feels overwhelming and like a
completely uphill struggle. There are so many times between the last album and this album
we’ve felt like hanging it up and calling it a quits simply because there’s always someone who
wants to leech off you, and yet there’s always someone who’s success is completely
undeserved. This was the first song we finished in the studio, and I think it’s really when it
became clear we weren’t the same band we were from the Self-titled album; we really went with
the big guitars and screamed vocals, and it was so much goddamn fun to do it, and it probably
shows.
"EASY DECISIONS"
I think just about anyone reading this has laid awake at night, worried about paying rent or bills.
That’s exactly what I wrote this about; deciding if I should spend the last few dollars I have on
groceries or my electric bill, do I pawn an amp or plead with a friend to borrow a few bucks for
gas? Those are tough decisions. The guitar part is actually the first thing I ever recorded, it’s
nearly 10 years old, but I never found a use for it until this album and I’m so happy it found a
home here, we ran it through a Roland Jazz Chorus and it felt ethereal when we heard it back,
and Gary just kept adding layer after layer on the 2nd half of this song until it became this
blissful wall of sound.
"IT DOESN’T GET ANY BETTER THAN THIS"
In a way this song sums up the previous 10; It has a bit of the sound all the previous ones had,
the lyrics are about how we’re just set up for extinction by technology and unfettered capitalism,
and it ends in a grand finale. We got to use all sorts of beautiful delays and reverbs on this, and
it just rocks hard. We liked it so much we named the album after the lyrics: “No Alternative in
sight, so they’ll exercise their right. There’s no way they got this wrong” - The whole album is
about systems, systems that aren’t failures, but actually working exactly as designed. We’re
overstimulated on purpose, we’re depressed on purpose, we’re numb on purpose.
"THERE WAS A HOLE HERE // IT’S GONE NOW"
This song was almost entirely written by Luke on guitar and bass. It’s so mesmerizing and haunting and we just had to have it on the album, but when it came time to write lyrics for it was so hard to get them right, we kept trying vocal deliveries that were super spacious and minimal, but it didn’t sound right, so Gary suggested we go with something unhinged and crazy, and that’s just what we ended up with. The lyrics are actually some of the most personal on the album, it’s my 2nd hand experience with a mental health emergency I once had with a friend and having to deal with them eventually using police force to take care of the situation. Unfortunately in this country we don’t have a way of helping those in need without sending police in which often makes the situation much worse and I think about having to do that every day. The end of this song is one of my favorite moments on the album. Luke, Gary and I all took turns recording our own version of the solo in the outro, Gary mixed it to taste so what you’re actually hearing is all 3 of us playing the solo at different moments.












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